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Tomb Kings 2500 pts

posted Jan 02, 2012 14:40:00 by JenPerson
I like my Tomb Kings list, but...the list doesn't like me back. It says that it doesn't feel the same way I do, but that we could still be friends. But then I call it up, and it never picks up or calls me back. I don't know why it said it wanted to be friends if it really didn't.

Wait, what was I talking about again??

Oh yeah. My list sucks. Take a look and then I'll explain afterwards all the things that aren't working.

Tomb King – Sword of Anti-Heroes, Armour of Destiny, Dragonbane Gem, shield 258

Liche Priest – Level 2, Lore of Nehekara, Hierophant 105
Liche Priest – Level 2, Lore of Nehekara, Sceptre of Stability 120
Necrotect – Cloak of Dunes 110
Tomb Herald – Battle Standard, Charmed Shield, Talisman of Preservation 135

40x Skeleton Warriors – spears, light armour, musician, standard bearer, champion 270
35x Skeleton Warriors – light armour, musician, standard bearer, champion 205
20x Skeleton Archers – musician, standard bearer 140
5x Skeleton Horse Archers – 70

4x Necropolis Knights – musician, standard bearer, champion 290
Tomb Scorpion – 85
Tomb Scorpion – 85

Casket of Souls – 135
Heirotitan – 175
Necrosphynx – 225
Screaming Skull Catapult – 90


Problem #1: The scorpions are over-priced. I've played 4 or 5 games with them, and I swear I have yet to have a game where they both come up. Sometimes neither one does. The problem is that you have to roll a 3+, and then try to avoid the misfire on the artillery die. Between those two things, they just won't come up for me. It's 170 points completely wasted.
Problem #2: The necrosphynx is terrible. Even though it flies and I usually get to charge by turn 2, 5 wounds and a 5+ armor save means it is usually nerfed by then. If I whiff my attacks (which I often do) it will die to crumble. Toughness 8 doesn't mean much when the opponent can always wound on a 6. And considering he's initiative 1, he usually doesn't even get to strike before he dies.
Problem #3: One catapult is not enough. I hardly ever hit stuff. I like how cheap it is, but since I have a heirotitan, necrosphynx, and casket in rare as well, I have no more rare points open for another one. Plus, the catapults are metal and I've heard they're a pain to put together. That's not such a big deal. I'd probably just convert it from some army's finecast catapult like I did with my other one.
Problem #4: Skeletons are so slow. I don't often get to choose who they are going to fight, which means it's usually not a fight in my favor.


In the long-term, I'm planning to do the following:
-drop the necrosphynx
-get another catapult
-drop the scorpions
-add another unit of 4 necropolis knights
-add at least one more necrotect
-drop the unit of skeletons with hand weapons
-add more skeletons to the unit with spears
-add another liche priest (perhaps) with the lore of light
-add a unit of chariots (perhaps) to fill out core

I would love some advice!
[Last edited Jan 02, 2012 14:43:29]
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16 replies
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Greg2thePerson said Jan 05, 2012 11:03:58
We've already talked about this a few times but I just had a couple more ideas so I thought I'd post them here.

I think you might want to consider dropping the Necrotect and/or the Tomb Herald. Combined, those two characters are worth quite a bit of points and perhaps the opportunity cost is too high. For the same cost of the Tomb Herald, you could have another unit of Archers (I know you're dying to paint more skeletons), or 2 Necropolis Knights, or a Screaming Skull Catapult with the Skulls of the Foe upgrade.

The Necrotect is a nice addition to the Necropolis Knights, but he significantly increases the cost of that unit. Even in the best case scenario, he is probably only granting the unit Hatred in one round of combat before he dies. The 6+ Regeneration is okay, but again, 110 points can go pretty far in a Tomb Kings list... Maybe the Necrotect would be better off in a unit of infantry where he doesn't have to take a 50 point magic item.
The slightly less beautiful host.
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Gargobot said Jan 07, 2012 18:28:19
So I took the liberty of making two lists that both have your existing list as a basis. I hope you don't think that is rude, I'm certainly not trying to tell you what to do, but I had some difficulties expressing my thoughts and it just seemed easier this way.

The first list tries to incorporate some of your points (extra Necrotect, Catapult and Knights) and Greg's (drop the Cloak and Herald). The herald has turned into a prince so you can have two units with high WS and hatred, they can still function as anvils but also dish out some damage if you want to.
In this army list I downgraded the Sword of Anti-Heroes to the Warrior Bane, just to still have a magical weapon in the army. In any case you could always shuffle around with unit sizes and squeeze that back in.


Tomb King, General, Shield, Warrior Bane, Dragonbane Gem, Armour of Destiny - 233 Pts.

Liche Priest, Hierophant, lvl2, Lore of Nehekhara - 105 Pts.
Liche Priest, lvl2, Sceptre of Stability, Lore of Nehekhara - 120 Pts.
Necrotect - 60 Pts.
Necrotect - 60 Pts.
Tomb Prince, Shield, Talisman of Preservation - 147 Pts.

50 Skeleton Warriors, LA, Spears, M, S, C - 330 Pts.
20 Skeleton Archers, M, S - 140 Pts.
40 Skeleton Warriors, LA, M, S, C - 230 Pts.
5 Skeleton Horse Archers - 70 Pts.

4 Necropolis Knights, M, S, C - 290 Pts.
3 Necropolis Knights, M, S, C - 225 Pts.

Casket of Souls - 135 Pts.
Hierotitan - 175 Pts.
Skull Catapult - 90 Pts.
Skull Catapult - 90 Pts.

Total: 2500

In the second list I tried to squeeze in a heavy hitter in the form of a Grave Guard horde, the list also has a second Necrotect so both your units have hatred and you can decide from game to game whether you wanna go over the top with the Grave Guard or support the core skellies.


Tomb King, General, Shield, Warrior Bane, Dragonbane Gem, Armour of Destiny - 233 Pts.

Liche Priest, Hierophant, lvl2, Lore of Nehekhara - 105 Pts.
Liche Priest, lvl2, Sceptre of Stability, Lore of Nehekhara - 120 Pts.
Necrotect - 60 Pts.
Necrotect - 60 Pts.

45 Skeleton Warriors, LA, Spears, M, S, C - 300 Pts.
20 Skeleton Archers, M, S - 140 Pts.
5 Skeleton Horse Archers - 70 Pts.

3 Necropolis Knights, M, S, C - 225 Pts.
3 Necropolis Knights, M, S, C - 225 Pts.
40 Grave Guard, M, S, C - 470 Pts.

Casket of Souls - 135 Pts.
Hierotitan - 175 Pts.
Skull Catapult - 90 Pts.
Skull Catapult - 90 Pts.

Total: 2498

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JenPerson said Jan 08, 2012 13:33:44
Wow, Gargabot, thanks for your help! Having a king and a prince would be nice. Then I could have higher weapon skill in two units.

I bought a finecast grudge thrower the other day so that I can start making my next screaming skull catapult :-)

I played a game with Jon on Friday, and he noted that the blocks of skeletons cannot keep up with the faster things in the army. Therefore, I'm going to try to include a unit of chariots and see how that goes. I started putting them together last night. I'm trying out using green stuff to make "splashing" effects around some of the wheels as though they are going through a puddle. The truth is, I'm pretty awful with green stuff, so it looks terrible so far, but I'm going to keep at it nonetheless!

Again, thanks for your input! I'm excited to try out these new lists!
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CalebEdwards said Jan 09, 2012 17:08:47
As someone whose struggled with the same problem, I'd offer similar advice. My lists rely on lots of chariots -- 6 attacks for 55 points, good movement and good leadership (plus impact hits). I find it hard not to take them, especially because they synergize better with the +1 attack spell -- they can shoot, and it gives them an additional 4 attacks per model (as opposed to 2 with the necro knights).

Second, i always want to put in a tomb king, but end up dropping it. 70 points over a tomb prince is a LOT to pay for +1 strength, +1 wound, +1 attack and +1 ws. For the price of a kitted out king, you could have 2 semi-kitted out princes. And you could then take a high liche priest (I think it's useful to have the heiro have an extra wound -- it just makes him slightly safer).

I do think another unit of necro knights would help, as would another screaming skull. My other favourite, although not possible at Conflict, is 3 sphinxes -- redundancy is always helpful.

(EDITED to correct it to 6 attacks -- only the champ gets 7 -- i like to include him b/c you can do some shenanigans with challenges with such a big base).
[Last edited Jan 10, 2012 19:50:14]
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JenPerson said Jan 10, 2012 23:58:11
You know, I never thought about the fact that having a liche high priest would give him an extra wound. Even so, I don't usually worry about my hierophant dying. The tomb king gives the army leadership 10, so even if the hierophant dies, I am unlikely to lose many models. I keep most units pretty close to the king for that very reason. Still, it's something to consider. What I'm doing now certainly doesn't work, so I might as well try it!
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Gargobot said Jan 11, 2012 03:29:03
He also has Toughness 4 which can make a huge difference. I think the Liche High Priest is the more competitive choice and can easily be exchanged with the King if you take only one Priest or only one Necrotect. The second option would give you the whole of the Lore of Nehekhara or the signature spell thrice, which could help with the problems that the skellies can't keep up.

So while I'm waiting for a wash to dry I made another list based on your OP list taking the latest posts into account(High Priest, chariots). It also features most of what has been discussed before and almost every point of your initial long-term goals (everything except for the additional Necrotect and Lore of Light Priest).
It looks like this:

Liche High Priest, Hierophant, lvl4, Talisman of Preservation, Earthing Rod, Lore of Nehekhara - 280 Pts.

Liche Priest, lvl2, Scroll, Lore of Nehekhara - 130 Pts.
Necrotect - 60 Pts.
Tomb Prince, General, GW, Chariot, Dragonbane Gem, Armour of Silvered Steel - 209 Pts.

55 Skeleton Warriors, LA, Spears, M, S, C - 360 Pts.
5 Skeleton Horse Archers - 70 Pts.
5 Chariot, M, S, C, Banner of Swiftness - 320 Pts.

4 Necropolis Knights, M, S, C - 290 Pts.
4 Necropolis Knights, M, S, C - 290 Pts.

Hierotitan - 175 Pts.
Skull Catapult - 90 Pts.
Skull Catapult - 90 Pts.
Casket of Souls - 135 Pts.

Total: 2499

The chariot unit might seem a little big 5 strong but it gives you enough excess wounds to have a "look out sir" for the prince until he's in combat and to have the unit in fighting shape once they engage the enemy. An alternative would be to take out the Banner of Swiftness and a couple of skellies and you could take two units of 3 chariots. At a second glance I'd probably not give the Prince a chariot...


Liche High Priest, Hierophant, lvl4, Talisman of Preservation, Earthing Rod, Lore of Nehekhara - 280 Pts.

Liche Priest, lvl2, Scroll, Lore of Nehekhara - 130 Pts.
Necrotect - 60 Pts.
Tomb Prince, General, GW, Dragonbane Gem, Armour of Silvered Steel - 154 Pts.

56 Skeleton Warriors, LA, Spears, M, S, C - 366 Pts.
5 Skeleton Horse Archers - 70 Pts.
3 Chariot, S, C - 185 Pts.
3 Chariot, S, C - 185 Pts.

4 Necropolis Knights, M, S, C - 290 Pts.
4 Necropolis Knights, M, S, C - 290 Pts.

Hierotitan - 175 Pts.
Skull Catapult - 90 Pts.
Skull Catapult - 90 Pts.
Casket of Souls - 135 Pts.

Total: 2500

No musicians in the chariot units, but this seems like the stronger list to me (besides 10 pts are a bit steep for an army that never needs to rally). In any case the big plus point of chariots is that you have only one unit of infantry which should minimize the problem of them hanging behind. Another plus point is that the wash has now dried. :)

*paints*

Okay the second list stinks! Chariot units of three? Except for choice cuts they don't stand a chance against most enemy units, because they'll have trouble getting through their steadfast and can't stand any form of prolonged grinding. And the whole anvil and hammer tactic, that I as an Empire player am a firm believer in, won't work with only one anvil...

Only one catapult but two infantry blocks:
Liche High Priest, Hierophant, lvl4, Talisman of Preservation, Earthing Rod, Lore of Nehekhara - 280 Pts.

Liche Priest, lvl2, Scroll, Lore of Nehekhara - 130 Pts.
Necrotect - 60 Pts.
Tomb Prince, General, GW, Dragonbane Gem, Armour of Silvered Steel - 154 Pts.

40 Skeleton Warriors, LA, Spears, M, S, C - 270 Pts.
5 Skeleton Horse Archers - 70 Pts.
3 Chariot, S, C - 185 Pts.
3 Chariot, S, C - 185 Pts.
31 Skeleton Warriors, LA, M, S, C - 185 Pts.

4 Necropolis Knights, M, S, C - 290 Pts.
4 Necropolis Knights, M, S, C - 290 Pts.

Hierotitan - 175 Pts.
Skull Catapult - 90 Pts.
Casket of Souls - 135 Pts.

Total: 2499

31 Warriors? That's hardly anything. If any of you think this is getting more and more erratic I should probably mention that it's the middle of the night here. Now I'm really curious how you fit the chariots in your list Jen? Makes great sense to ask you about TK army lists when it's the whole point of why you started the thread. *rollseyes* I just hope any of these Rantings of a Madman™ help you build a better list. :)


[Last edited Jan 11, 2012 03:32:54]
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JenPerson said Jan 16, 2012 01:33:26
Guess what?? I finished the tournament with three wins! I think I did about as well as the other TK players. Go figure! That being said, the chariots may not be necessary, or perhaps 3-4 would be sufficient.

Here's what I'd say about the performance of the various units:
-Necropolis knights were amazing. Still think I need more.
-As predicted, necrosphynx sucked. He died in every game and never came close to making up his points. Heck, he probably didn't make up his points overall in all six games!
-Necrotect was great in one game, but besides that, hardly served a purpose. He died in 5 out of 6 games.
-I still like two liche priests with the Lore of Nehekara. Having desert wind on both of them was necessary to keep my army mobile, not to mention alive due to the lore attribute. I was able to get off spells in most games, except for the two games where I played dwarves with mega anti-magic.
-Tomb King didn't do too much. He whiffed a lot of his attacks. A necrotect in his unit would've been very helpful.
-Skeletons were slower than the rest of the army, but what saves me is risking it with long charges. If I make it, then awesome. If I don't, I'm still moving about the same distance I would have anyway. I think I'd do better to consolidate to one larger unit with hand weapons. The spears look pretty, but so aren't worth it.
-The best part about the Casket of Souls is the +d3 casting dice. I maxed out on dice at least 75% of the time, which gave me a great advantage in casting. I was often able to save six dice to cast light of death. That was kind of a fizzle though, doing no more than 10 wounds the whole tournament.
-Heirotitan was amazing. He lived through most turns in most games, keeping my magic boosted. I was also able to throw in front of a [f***ing] death star of 27 chaos knights and two characters to hold them up for a turn.
-Archers seem terrible, but always hitting on 5s was useful. I was able to shoot at things no one expected I would get. Unfortunately, I was not able to wound those things. They make a nice bunker for the heirophant, but nothing more. Statistically, it's not worth it to take more of them, but I'd like to keep them the way they are now.
-Catapult hit every time one game, and misfired every time another game. I definitely need two of them.
-Light horsemen were AMAZING! I finally feel like I'm learning how to use them. They are best suited to redirection of large, scary stuff.
-Scorpions served me better than they ever have before. They both came up (eventually) in every game, and did some great redirection stuff in a few cases. Even so, they're just too chancy. I'd rather have another unit or two of light horsemen, with points left over for other stuff.
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Gargobot said Jan 18, 2012 01:02:11
Hey congrats!
Maybe the whole Skeletons are falling behind issue could be resolved with a more shooty list. If you take all bows on your skeletons and field the double catapult plus Casket of Souls most opponents will have to come to you. You're faster units could be held back until you need them and the Necrosphynx with it's ability to charge over your units should be more useful and even if it isn't it's a lot better protected.
But I guess if every TK player had pretty much the same results as you did, your list isn't in need of major changes after all. :)
Congrats again on the solid performance, I look forward to hearing about the tourney on the show. ^^

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noah.nathanson said Jan 18, 2012 23:19:47
Awesome job Jen, and congrats again on the painting score as well! I bet you'll end up being at the top of our group ;o)

As far as switching up your list goes (if you still want to) any restrictions? I played against two level 4's that was pretty rough, but I don't think that's really your style.
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JenPerson said Jan 22, 2012 13:28:03
Oh yeah? Two level 4s? One must've had the Lore of Nehekara, but do you remember what the other one had?

True, it's not really my style. I might try it once just to see though!
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noah.nathanson said Jan 22, 2012 14:43:46
One level 4 on Nehekara, the other on Light. They were in a bunker of archers with a tomb prince. The heiro had a 4+ ward and the other level 4 had the MR 2 item, so the heirophant had a 2+ ward versus my death snipe spells. The combination overall was killer. I've got his whole list, I can show it to you at the store later and/or post it up here.
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noah.nathanson said Jan 23, 2012 00:57:51
Well, I was on the receiving end of Jen's new TK list today and let me tell you... it was just a liiiiiiiiiiiittle bit rough :) I still think the Tomb King may not be a necessary. I have to run the points, but even if you dropped it from a King to a Prince you could squeeze in a unit of 3 carrion. I don't know, but even the fighty version of your lord, is it ever a game changer for you?
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JenPerson said Jan 23, 2012 11:25:55
I'd say the TK is a game changer because he is leadership 10. I'm not that worried about the hierophant dying because my army tends to crowd around my leadership 10 general, meaning I don't take much crumbling, if any. I don't think I'd have enough room in my hero slot to take another tomb prince anyway.
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CalebEdwards said Jan 23, 2012 22:44:58
just my two cents, but I'm not sure that the extra point of leadership (and WS) is worth 70 points more... Maybe at 150 points... :D. But if you don't have room in the hero slot, it's probably worth it to have someone.

I'm thinking that for the next tourney i take TK in (may be retiring them if I can get my brets painted in time), I'll go back to a triple-sphinx list with two L3+s (depending on points). I might take a prince in there, but I doubt I'd take a tomb king...

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noah.nathanson said Jan 24, 2012 00:41:35
32 extra points swaps the two level 2's and the TK for 2 level 3's (one with the scepter of stability) and a tomb prince with the 4+ ward save heavy armor.

There's still plenty of room in lord and hero allotment for equipment etc. It'll give you many more casting options, +1 wound and toughness on each of your casters, and would make your casting phase that much bigger.
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